To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "Willem-Jan Markerink" Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 22:26:54 +0200 Subject: [Volvo303] Slip-joint covers Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com We once had a few threads about the driveshaft U-joints (being compatible with generic US-stuff)....but never about the rubber covers/bellows around the slip-joints, correct? Has anyone digged out the partnumber for that? And does it come as rubber-only, or including the two hose-clamps front and rear? Also, in more general/pondering context: Not many offroad vehicles have such rubber covers on their slip- joints AFAIK....is this considered military overkill, or is the Volvo design more vulnerable to dirt in some way? (the danger with some brands is also that if you press in too much grease into the slip-joint, they almost become rigid, resulting in vibrations....any risk of that with Volvo's, typically? -- Bye, Willem-Jan Markerink The desire to understand is sometimes far less intelligent than the inability to understand [note: 'a-one' & 'en-el'!] To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "Jim Molloy" Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 01:33:36 -0000 Subject: [Volvo303] Re: Slip-joint covers Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com --- In Volvo303@yahoogroups.com, "Willem-Jan Markerink" wrote: > We once had a few threads about the driveshaft U-joints (being > compatible with generic US-stuff)....but never about the rubber > covers/bellows around the slip-joints, correct? > Has anyone digged out the partnumber for that? > And does it come as rubber-only, or including the two hose-clamps > front and rear? > > Also, in more general/pondering context: > Not many offroad vehicles have such rubber covers on their slip- > joints AFAIK....is this considered military overkill, or is the Volvo > design more vulnerable to dirt in some way? > (the danger with some brands is also that if you press in too much > grease into the slip-joint, they almost become rigid, resulting in > vibrations....any risk of that with Volvo's, typically? WJ, The part number I find for the rubber bellows is: 232353-3 There are also a pair of hose clamps and three inner and two outer stiffening rings for the bellows. In my search for a generic replacement, this is what I have thus far. The shaft sizes are 1.75" (~45mm) diameter for smaller and 2.0" (~50mm) diameter for the larger end. Trailmaster Suspension offers a bellow for use on a shochk absorber that has IDs of 1.25"/2.0" and is 11" long in its relaxed state. It can be compressed to only 4" and has 11 corrugations over its lenght. The rubber is quite pliable and the smaller ID should have not problem stretching an additional 0.5" diameter. Kawasaki KLR650 front fork boot has 27 corrugations over its 12" OA length. Small ID is 1.5" and larger is 2"(but their is a small inner lip that fits into the lower fork leg. Still pliable although not as flexy as the Trailmaster boot. Should be able to stretch the additional 0.25" diameter. If anyone knows of something close taht was actually designed as a propeller shaft boot, that would actually be a better choice. Hope this helps. Jim Molloy Waldersee Farm http://www.northwestmogfest.com http://www.volvo4x4.com To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "John Utteridge" Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 11:08:53 -0000 Subject: [Volvo303] Re: Slip-joint covers Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com --- In Volvo303@yahoogroups.com, "Willem-Jan Markerink" wrote: > We once had a few threads about the driveshaft U-joints (being > compatible with generic US-stuff)....but never about the rubber > covers/bellows around the slip-joints, correct? > Has anyone digged out the partnumber for that? > And does it come as rubber-only, or including the two hose-clamps > front and rear? > > Also, in more general/pondering context:=20 > Not many offroad vehicles have such rubber covers on their slip- > joints AFAIK....is this considered military overkill, or is the Volvo > design more vulnerable to dirt in some way? > (the danger with some brands is also that if you press in too much > grease into the slip-joint, they almost become rigid, resulting in > vibrations....any risk of that with Volvo's, typically? If you want them, and cheap, the Land Rover ones would almost certainly fit (the props are almost identical in every way) they cost about =A33 from www.paddockspares.com, just look for any vehicle "propshaft gaiter", they're all almost identical. There's two schools of thought about gaiters in general - the military seem to like them, but others hate them. In theory they keep all the dirt and crud out, so are a very good idea. In theory. In practice, any tiny leak can let in mud, which fills the gaiter up and acts like grinding paste. Because there's a gaiter there, you can't see inside so don't know about it until it fails. It's also more time consuming to check the condition of stuff under the gaiters. I had military gaiters on the chrome swivels on my Land Rover, I took them off when one ripped on a rock and 2Kg of fine mud and sand came out! My preference is to NOT fit gaiters and clean/check/grease everything regularly. John To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "Willem-Jan Markerink" Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 13:45:07 +0200 Subject: Re: [Volvo303] Re: Slip-joint covers Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com On 17 Sep 2005 at 1:33, Jim Molloy wrote: > WJ, > The part number I find for the rubber bellows is: 232353-3 > There are also a pair of hose clamps and three inner and two outer > stiffening rings for the bellows. > > In my search for a generic replacement, this is what I have thus > far. The shaft sizes are 1.75" (~45mm) diameter for smaller and 2.0" > (~50mm) diameter for the larger end. > > Trailmaster Suspension offers a bellow for use on a shochk > absorber that has IDs of 1.25"/2.0" and is 11" long in its relaxed > state. It can be compressed to only 4" and has 11 corrugations over > its lenght. The rubber is quite pliable and the smaller ID should > have not problem stretching an additional 0.5" diameter. > > Kawasaki KLR650 front fork boot has 27 corrugations over its 12" > OA length. Small ID is 1.5" and larger is 2"(but their is a small > inner lip that fits into the lower fork leg. Still pliable although > not as flexy as the Trailmaster boot. Should be able to stretch the > additional 0.25" diameter. > > If anyone knows of something close taht was actually designed as a > propeller shaft boot, that would actually be a better choice. > > Hope this helps. Thanx! Did you also get a price estimate on any of those, in particular the OEM set, bellows-only and/or complete kit? (does it exist as a complete kit at all?) PS: can any of those 'zweck-entfremdet' bellows also be ordered in a bright funky color?....:)))) Willem (visualizing neon-yellow or neon-orange) Jan -- Bye, Willem-Jan Markerink The desire to understand is sometimes far less intelligent than the inability to understand [note: 'a-one' & 'en-el'!] To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "Jim Molloy" Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 15:27:17 -0000 Subject: [Volvo303] Re: Slip-joint covers Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com --- In Volvo303@yahoogroups.com, "Willem-Jan Markerink" wrote: > Did you also get a price estimate on any of those, in particular the > OEM set, bellows-only and/or complete kit? (does it exist as a > complete kit at all?) > > PS: can any of those 'zweck-entfremdet' bellows also be ordered in a > bright funky color?....:)))) > > > Willem (visualizing neon-yellow or neon-orange) Jan WJ, I own a pair of the Trailmaster boots. They came with a single black cable tie. The cost was somewhere on teh order of $15.00 USD for the pair. My set is black. I have seen on eBay some generic drive shaft boots in green, blue, orange and pink. The problem is that the large end is for shafts of 2.5" diameter or larger. I do not have a price for the EOM boot. Obtaining OEM parts in the US remains a major challenge. Jim Molloy Waldersee Farm http://www.northwestmogfest.com http://www.volvo4x4.com To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "Jim Molloy" Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 12:32:36 -0000 Subject: [Volvo303] Driveshaft bellows Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com Hello to all, While on the subject of parts crossreference, I have been told that the front and rear driveshaft rubber boots(or bellows) may be replaced with Land Rover items. If true, does anyone know a part number and/or model/year? Thanks. Jim Molloy Waldersee Farm http://www.northwestmogfest.com http://www.volvo4x4.com To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "rdoveryhoo" Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 12:42:04 -0000 Subject: [Volvo303] Re: Driveshaft bellows Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com --- In Volvo303@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Molloy" wrote: > > Hello to all, > While on the subject of parts crossreference, I have been told that > the front and rear driveshaft rubber boots(or bellows) may be replaced > with Land Rover items. If true, does anyone know a part number and/or > model/year? Thanks. Jim as I understand it any model of Defender/90/110/130 from Series3 onwards use the same slip length of drive shaft (aka propshaft). I fited standard ones from a 110 that I had left over from my LR hybrid. They cost me about UKP 1.50! IMHO the LR ones are better as they are longer. I use cable ties to fit them rather than jubilee clips as they don't rust! Richard www.volvoc303.co.uk To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "Willem-Jan Markerink" Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:56:34 +0200 Subject: Re: [Volvo303] Re: Driveshaft bellows Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com On 26 Oct 2005 at 12:42, rdoveryhoo wrote: > Jim > as I understand it any model of Defender/90/110/130 from Series3 > onwards use the same slip length of drive shaft (aka propshaft). I > fited standard ones from a 110 that I had left over from my LR hybrid. > They cost me about =A31.50! > > IMHO the LR ones are better as they are longer. I use cable ties to > fit them rather than jubilee clips as they don't rust! Does the LR-version also have the internal 'ribs' (metal(?) reinforcement/expansion structure) inside? That also seems to be a separate part to be ordered (and mounted), and apparently not available anymore, at least not within the Volvo database....and opinions differ a bit whether this part can be reused, cq doesn't typically wear/break.... Any opinions here on this subtle detail?....:)) -- Bye, Willem-Jan Markerink The desire to understand is sometimes far less intelligent than the inability to understand [note: 'a-one' & 'en-el'!] To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "rdoveryhoo" Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 13:21:19 -0000 Subject: [Volvo303] Re: Driveshaft bellows Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com --- In Volvo303@yahoogroups.com, "Willem-Jan Markerink" wrote: > > On 26 Oct 2005 at 12:42, rdoveryhoo wrote: > > > Jim > > as I understand it any model of Defender/90/110/130 from Series3 > > onwards use the same slip length of drive shaft (aka propshaft). I > > fited standard ones from a 110 that I had left over from my LR hybrid. > > They cost me about UKP 1.50! > > > > IMHO the LR ones are better as they are longer. I use cable ties to > > fit them rather than jubilee clips as they don't rust! > > Does the LR-version also have the internal 'ribs' (metal(?) > reinforcement/expansion structure) inside? > > That also seems to be a separate part to be ordered (and mounted), > and apparently not available anymore, at least not within the Volvo > database....and opinions differ a bit whether this part can be > reused, cq doesn't typically wear/break.... > > Any opinions here on this subtle detail?....:)) willem Mine are just stiff rubber. but enough of my medical problems!!! Richard To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: "Willem-Jan Markerink" Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2005 21:30:24 +0100 Subject: [Volvo303] Slip-joint cover, the continueing story....:)) Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com Anyone recently tried to find/order the complete slip-joint assembly? (bellows plus multiple inner ribs/rings, plus (what I just learned) a single 'toothed' slider/rib/ring in the center) (for which I still ponder about its function....someone claimed it was to prevent the bellows being chipped/nipped/punched by a compressing slip-joint, but since the splines have the same diameter as the solid shaft, the bellows could never get in harms way....which, IMO, only leaves the function of 'assuring rotation at the same speed' (problem perhaps being: sudden deceleration under braking?)....*or* a nifty method to keep the splines greased beyond their usual amount of 'travel'?....anyone ever heard a good explanation/justification? I tried to order a complete assembly, but apparently neither the inner rings are available today, *nor* the appropriate length of bellows (what I got is a 6-rib unit, while at least the front drive shaft originally has a 8-rib unit....oddly, the rear driveshaft(s) already had a shorter 6-rib bellows, but none of the other (military) TGB's I checked had those, hence 8-rib seems original). Which might throw us back to finding the actual source of the drive- shafts, in case it was a common accessory for that type/size of shaft.... *Or* find a generic supplier, with a product that matches at least the internal diameter, plus the spline-count.... (finding only a bellows is easy, but it's those inner rings that make things tricky) PS: I was told that 'polishing' the carburators would increase performance, in both idling and fuel-consumption? Any comments? -- Bye, Willem-Jan Markerink The desire to understand is sometimes far less intelligent than the inability to understand [note: 'a-one' & 'en-el'!] To: From: "John Allen" Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 07:46:44 +1000 Subject: RE: [Volvo303] Slip-joint cover, the continueing story....:)) Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com You should not have any trouble with generic tail shaft - the uni's are really common standard off the shelf unit. And the tail shaft manufacturers have suitable slip joints- same thing with generic slip joint bellows. I had my tail shafts replaced (new ones made) and it was no problem John Allen To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com From: Teppo Rapo Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2005 00:08:42 +0200 (EET) Subject: RE: [Volvo303] Slip-joint cover, WARNING! Reply-To: Volvo303@yahoogroups.com John Allen kirjoitti 17.11.2005 kello 23:46: > You should not have any trouble with generic tail shaft - the uni's are > really common standard off the shelf unit. And the tail shaft > manufacturers > have suitable slip joints- same thing with generic slip joint bellows. > I had my tail shafts replaced (new ones made) and it was no problem > John Allen > A bit off-topic but a word of advice, NEVER lubricate propeller shaft slides if you don't know what you are doing, I really advice you to remove whole shat for lubrication. It's very common to brake joints and bearings due to greasing. So what will happen is that seal of the dustcover at slip joint is too tight and joint starts to act like a hydraulic cylinder, more you pump greas in more it will extend. I did that mistake but luckilly my friend stopped me and we remover the shaft, There was so much pressure in the joint that we had to use crowbar to get it off! We should have removed the grease nibble at that point but we were lazy and the nibble was pointing a bit difficult direction. Then we removed the grease nibble and when we pushed the shaft against the floor, there came bunch of grease out from the joint and free-movement of the joint was less than half with too much grease in it. In future I will do it like this, I will remove and disassemble the slip-joint, wash it up carefully and lubricate the joint separately with light film of the grease, then put it back together and instal. _NO_ grease from a nibble never again. you could do that but you need to be sure that there is not too much grease in. -teppo Teppo Rapo +358 40 5508394 Riimusauvantie 9 FIN-00740 Helsinki