FROM: "Kenneth W. Dicks" SUBJECT: Re: Cummins/Navistar diesels DATE: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 20:06:59 -0500 ORGANIZATION: BrightNet Wisconsin NEWSGROUPS: rec.autos.4x4 Deron Hartman wrote: > heard that the Navistar's have had problems with pin holes forming on the > cylinder walls but they could be prevented with special oil. Is this true? > Do either of these engines have any quirks? Do they require much > maintenance? Thanks. > > Deron I looked into this several months ago and found much information on the web. It was not the oil ( good oil keeps the engine clean) but a good quality of antifreeze (and additives) that stopped the pitting. This can be a problem with ALL brands of diesels, so test that coolant! kwd FROM: Mike Locke SUBJECT: Re: Cummins/Navistar diesels DATE: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 20:49:31 -0700 ORGANIZATION: http://extra.newsguy.com NEWSGROUPS: rec.autos.4x4 Kenneth W. Dicks wrote: > Deron Hartman wrote: > > > heard that the Navistar's have had problems with pin holes forming on the > > cylinder walls but they could be prevented with special oil. Is this true? > > Do either of these engines have any quirks? Do they require much > > maintenance? Thanks. > > > > Deron > > I looked into this several months ago and found much information on the > web. It was not the oil ( good oil keeps the engine clean) but a good > quality of antifreeze (and additives) that stopped the pitting. This can be > a problem with ALL brands of diesels, so test that coolant! > kwd Cavitation is a problem with diesels that have cylinder liners. The Navistar has liners. The Cummins does not. You do not need to put the additive in the Cummins coolant. The Cummins is reputed to last longer, get better fuel economy, and be more rebuildable than the Navistar. The Navistar has a more "car like" throttle response. Either engine can be altered to produce a lot more than stock power; both engines when stock produce enough torque to seriously challenge the stock transmission (I am presuming that we are talking about a Dodge and a Ford truck). Both Ford and Dodge have problems with their automatic transmissions coupled to these engines. The Navistar has glow plugs that are expensive and fail fairly frequently (people report several failures over 100kmiles). The Cummins has a heater tube that is reputed to "never fail". That's good because a Navistar will start even if several glow plugs fail, but the Cummins will not start if the heater tube fails. The Navistar takes a 15quart oil change every 3000 miles of "severe duty" usage. The Cummins takes a 11quart oil change every 5000 miles of "severe duty" usage. Couple that with the Navistar oil filter being much more expensive than the Cummins oil filter, and you will see that over the life of the engine the maintenance on the Navistar will be much more expensive than for the Cummins. You can get a "factory approved, does not void the engine warranty" exhaust brake for the Cummins. No such thing is available for the Ford-Navistar. Obviously, each engine has its plusses and minuses. Buy the one you want. I gonna try to put in an order for my Cummins tomorrow. The fuel economy and engine life are slight controversial items. Cummins claims an *average* engine life of 400,000 miles. Folks counter that they once saw a Navistar last 400,000 miles. Well folks, there is a big difference between *average* and *maximum*. Cummins also reports that an RV delivery agency reported to them that one of their Dodge-Cummins tow vehicles has 1,000,000 miles on the original, never rebuilt engine. Regarding the fuel economy, it does seem that the more power, reduced smog ISB5.9 Cummins gets worse fuel economy than the old B5.9. However, according to Cummins this is in large part because the gears provided by Dodge are too low for maximum fuel economy. Dodge provides performance oriented gears with the Cummins; if you want fuel economy get bigger tires or raise the gears (lower the ratio). -- S'later, Mike Locke karenml@rahul.net or lockem@scrserv.com FROM: P.Young@unsw.EDU.AU (Patrick Young) SUBJECT: Re: Shitty Toyota Diesels DATE: 6 Apr 2002 05:06:34 -0800 ORGANIZATION: http://groups.google.com/ NEWSGROUPS: aus.cars.offroad "Shane Hurenkamp" wrote in message news:<3cad7a1f$0$9991$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au>... Shane, I don't know about the 2L however my 3L is *SWEET* at 162,000 KM I installed a turbo on it back in 1993. It shows no signs of even starting to wear - the idle speed remains unchanged for the last 20,000 KM for example. I'm expecting that it will see me out (I'm 35 years of age) however the crapulence of *ALL* products on the market now, including the current Hilux (had a new one in Perth a couple of months back) would stop me from buying a new 4WD *anything*. Petrol (gas pig) shit? - no, you don't want it. You did maintain it properly???? I don't think you did!. A diesel will need frequent coolant changes due to cavitation. Leave dirty, or *even worse* rusty water in the cooling system of a diesel and you can kiss it goodbye (2L and 3L are cast iron). FROM: "Tony Smith" SUBJECT: Re: Shitty Toyota Diesels DATE: Sun, 7 Apr 2002 17:21:39 +1000 ORGANIZATION: Customer of Connect.com.au Pty. Ltd. NEWSGROUPS: aus.cars.offroad > > A diesel will need frequent coolant changes due to cavitation. Would you kindly explain this slowly and in english. -- Cheers Tony Smith Connected to the internet in Sunny Far North Queensland Australia http://www.tonsyl.org FROM: P.Young@unsw.EDU.AU (Patrick Young) SUBJECT: Re: Shitty Toyota Diesels DATE: 7 Apr 2002 06:58:10 -0700 ORGANIZATION: http://groups.google.com/ NEWSGROUPS: aus.cars.offroad "Tony Smith" wrote in message news:... > > > A diesel will need frequent coolant changes due to cavitation. > > Would you kindly explain this slowly and in english. No problem... The vibration and heat of a diesel engine causes tiny bubbles of gas to form in the cooling water. The bubbles cling to the water jacket side of the cylinder walls (and cylinder head). But the next firing cycle comes with another heavy vibration that bursts the bubbles. So what? Well, as each bubble bursts, it implodes a microscopic particle of cast iron from the wall. Because of irregularities in the casting surface of the wall, bubbles tend to cling at the same place. And burst at the same place. And remove a microscopic particle at the same place. The rust/dirty part needs no further explaination at this point - I can provide further information if required.