From: "graham porter" To: <80_series@corp.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] Big End Bearing Help Needed Date sent: Tue, 11 May 1999 20:18:41 +0930 Send reply to: 80_series@corp.sgi.com ----- Original Message ----- From: charlene Morris To: <80_series@corp.sgi.com> Sent: Tuesday, 11 May 1999 5:33 Subject: Re: [80] Big End Bearing Help Needed > Please any Aussie members had their big ends done by TOYOTA, I need to defend my > case with case details I'm looking down the barrel of a Two Thousand Dollar Bill., > > Charlene > > Hi Charlene, we had our LC bottom end fixed up September last year 1998. We had done 170,000 kms when it went big time out in the middle of the sticks north of Charleville towing a caravan. It was shipped back to ADELAIDE for repairs and we were told that the crank was stuffed as well as one conrod and all the bottom end bearings , quote to repair was $6500.00 !!!!!. But I stuck my ground and quoted the details obtained from this group about the problem bearings in the 92-94 cruisers. The dealer offered me 50/50 on the repairs but I still refused and the dealer advised me to contact the TOYOTA Corp customer service line which I did. Final outcome was a repair bill of $450.00 for which I was grateful although since then I have heard of LCs being repaired here in ADELAIDE free of cost all were high mileage units of around 160.000kms plus... hope the above will be some help to you and good luck with the repairs... let me know how you get on and If I can be of any more help please let me know either via the group or direct email ( grakat@picknowl) Cheers from Graham & Cathy Date sent: Tue, 11 May 1999 04:13:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Andre Sabeeney Subject: Re: [80] Big End Bearing Help Needed To: 80_series@corp.sgi.com, 80_series@corp.sgi.com Send reply to: 80_series@corp.sgi.com Charlene, I had my LC 1991 TD repaired by Toyota, I had a slight ticking sound, went to toyota and asked if they would check it out, they determined that there may be a big end problem, they suggested that they strip it down and replace the bearings, the dealer quoted $1300 I said is this a common problem with them and can it be claimed under warranty, car had 175,000 kms he said how much would I be preparred to pay ? I said nothing ! he put the claim in and results were very favourable, they agreed to pay for everything. my service history was not perfect, ie not every 5000km services was recorded, however to my knowledge they were done. The reason I believe I had no problem was that I happened to take the car to a brand new dealership that only had just opened a week before, I believe that they pushed Toyota Australia harder to gain some bussines ! good luck ! === Andre Sabeeney sabeeney@yahoo.com.au ph 0419 858 006 _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Free instant messaging and more at http://messenger.yahoo.com From: "Norm Needham" To: <80_series@corp.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] Big End Bearing Help Needed Date sent: Tue, 11 May 1999 23:34:47 +1000 Send reply to: 80_series@corp.sgi.com From: Michael Barson Date: Tuesday, 11 May 1999 21:30 >Charlene and Andre, i have had two 80's 92 and a 97 both had cranks and >bearings replaced one at 20000klm and the other 40000klm approx. both Mick, You mention your 97 model having crank/bearings replaced. Can we have some more details? Specifically: 1) Was this the 1HD-FT (24 valve turbo diesel) engine? 2) What were the symptoms that caused the repairs? 3) Did you see the damaged parts, and if so, were the bearing shells pitted? Sorry to quiz you like this, but the 1HD-FT is NOT known for the same bearing problem as the 1HD-T (12 valve). Many of the list members have 1HD-FTs and right about now will be praying that yours was an isolated case. Cheers * Norm Needham * * Traction4 / ARB Northside * Sydney, Australia * Trac4@bigpond.com Date sent: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:48:19 +0800 To: 80_series@corp.sgi.com From: Michael Barson Subject: Re: [80] Big End Bearing Help Needed Send reply to: 80_series@corp.sgi.com ,At 11:34 11/05/99 +1000, you wrote: >From: Michael Barson >Date: Tuesday, 11 May 1999 21:30 > > >>Charlene and Andre, i have had two 80's 92 and a 97 both had cranks and >>bearings replaced one at 20000klm and the other 40000klm approx. both > > >Mick, >You mention your 97 model having crank/bearings replaced. Can we have >some more details? >Specifically: >1) Was this the 1HD-FT (24 valve turbo diesel) engine? >2) What were the symptoms that caused the repairs? >3) Did you see the damaged parts, and if so, were the bearing shells >pitted? > >Sorry to quiz you like this, but the 1HD-FT is NOT known for the same >bearing problem as the 1HD-T (12 valve). Many of the list members have >1HD-FTs and right about now will be praying that yours was an isolated >case. > >Cheers * >Norm Needham * * >Traction4 / ARB Northside * >Sydney, Australia * >Trac4@bigpond.com Norm it is a 24 valve model Turbo Diesel as i said i also had an earlier 12 valve model that had the same noise / symptoms. No i did not see the bearings i was told that the crankshafts had been machined incorrectly and that was the cause. I was also told that the reason that i have the same problem again is that its possible one of the old "batch"of cranks has been put in the second time around.( but that does not explain the original crank in the 24 V, Sounds strange to me but the noise is identical to the previous model. All i can do is hope that its fixed this time. Also this same vehicle has had a LHR electric window motor replaced, drivers seat material replaced (does not wear as good as the previous material) and the wiper motor needs attention, apparently some of them have dry solder joints and it takes a while for them to speed up from low to fast wiper speed ( about 30 - 40 seconds for mine) That is coming from my local dealer. any one else had these nigly problems? Mick Date sent: Mon, 17 May 1999 22:54:14 +1000 To: 80_series@corp.sgi.com From: Terence J Leeder Subject: [80] Secret info from Toyota Shhhhh (Chat) Send reply to: 80_series@corp.sgi.com I have been at Toyota Taren Point NSW OZ, on some Diesel Training for today and tomorrow (Mon & Tue). Interestingly the Trainer did his usual welcome and we responded with whom we were etc. The trainer then asked if there were any reports from the field that the mechanics would like to report!!!!. Three guys simultaniously blurted out the 1HD-T Big End Problems they were having etc. I sat back and listened intently. the conversation then widened with all responding???. We are also talking a few engines with electrical problems as well, IE: alternator busted off the block by a wayward Conrod etc. Pistons hitting heads, bent valves etc. official response "Toyota are honouring a Case by Case extended Warranty on these Small occurances". He then went on to say that they are aware of a few isolated cases that generally occured at aprox 120+k and were a little ?????, as it is all over the Internet?.. The Trainer could not confirm that the replacement bigends were of better quality. Some dealers were replacing these with ACL brand bearings until knuckles were caned. I picked up a good book on the 1HD-FTE engine YUM, More soon. Shit I hope I dont get my ass kicked for this. Hello Mr Toyota, I really didn't mean it, really I'm sorry. MoRAn mOe,, Te he, Date sent: Sun, 16 May 1999 07:47:48 -0600 From: Roger Loving To: 80_series@corp.sgi.com Subject: Re: [80] Secret info from Toyota Shhhhh (Chat) Send reply to: 80_series@corp.sgi.com Thank you Terence. You are a brave man....I'll try to defuse any consequences by pointing out that you are confirming what all of us already suspected, and that it has been confirmed in the past by the "case by case" reports of extended warranty coverage from respected members on this list. If Mr. Toyota is reading the list I hope this helps! Otherwise you had better don the flackproof jacket ASAP.. :-) Good luck! Roger Loving Date sent: Tue, 18 May 1999 06:59:08 +1000 From: georgec@melbourne.sgi.com (George Couyant) Organization: SGI To: 80_series@corp.sgi.com Subject: Re: [80] Secret info from Toyota Shhhhh (Chat) Send reply to: 80_series@corp.sgi.com Well Terry, don't be concerned. It's like talking about the weather. Sun and rain happens, no matter how quiet you try to keep it, just like big ends. It's a pity the trainer was a little ???? about it being on the internet. You can let him know Toyota PR support (begrudgingly) what we're doing on this issue. In fact saving Toyota and our members (and 1HD-T public) a bunch of money by catching failures before they become major. It's a clever way Toyota can get the word out without fessing up that there is a problem. And they can always point the finger at us and say we're a bunch of arseholes for spreading bullshit. I'm about to hit Toyota again because over the past couple of months, there have been several big 1HD-T failures and Toyota have refused any support. The service reps won't even look at them. All on the grounds that they are well out of warranty. Seems that there have been a few new service faces out in the field that are unaware of the problem. Cheers gc '97 HDJ80 - Melbourne Oz http://reality.sgi.com/80_series/bios/george_couyant.html Subject: [80] 1HD-T Big end bearings... Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Oh man, when it rains, it pours.... Tally for this week. And I mean just this week. 4 major failures 10 vehicles checked, 7 with dud bearings. And that's only the ones I know of in our state. They're getting to that mileage.... If you haven't checked them, DO IT NOW. Don't wait for a dealer to approve it. Just do it and pay for it. A $600 job now is a lot cheaper and less frustrating than fighting with Toyota and being without the car for ages while it's being fixed. THEN make a claim to your local dealer. Cheers gc '97 HDJ80 - Melbourne Oz From: "Bob Reaburn" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] 1HD-T Big end bearings... Date sent: Fri, 11 Jun 1999 20:13:00 +1000 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Very sound advice George. At 185,000km the bearings in my 1HD-T were in extremely poor condition(stuffed). One had a hole that you could put the tip of your pinkie(as in little finger) through. Try talking to the dealership first, I did and they carried out the repair promptly and at no cost to me. It seems to me that Toyota, whilst not openly admitting that there is a problem, have directed their dealers to placate any owners who are well informed and are insistent that they(Toyota) make good with the repairs. I approached the dealer armed with a large collection of relevant evidence, including photographs of buggered bearings. At some time during the discussion I might also have said that I had become so disillusioned with Toyota that I was considering replacing my 80 with a..... PPP.....PPPPPaaa.....PPPPaaaattttt....PPPPPaaaat-ttrrroooll. Yes, it was hard to get that word out but desperate situations demand desperate measures. Besides I had my fingers crossed and I washed my mouth out when I got home. Cheers, Bob Reaburn 91 HDJ80 - Bendigo (Downunder) From: moie@effect.net.au (Anthony Siracusa) To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: [80] 1HD-T Big End Bearings Date sent: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 23:57:36 +1000 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Hi Can someone help please. I have a 1994 GXL Turbo Diesel with a manufacture date of October 1994. After reading all about big end bearing failure I went to my Toyota dealer to get mine checked. I was told that the problem was only with vehicles manufacture up till September 1994 and, as my truck was October 1994 manufacture, it should have had the beefed up bearings installed during manufacture. The dealer was able to give this appraisal after checking my chassis/VIN number. Can anybody throw any light on this or tell me how I can check it out for myself please. Thanks Tony Siracusa Date sent: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 08:09:02 +1000 From: George Couyant Organization: SGI To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Subject: Re: [80] 1HD-T Big End Bearings Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Anthony Siracusa wrote: > Can anybody throw any light on this or tell me how I can check it out for > myself please. Look at the manufacturing plate on the firewall in the engine compartment. If it says 1HD-FT you're okay. If it says 1HD-T then you should have them checked if you've done more than 100,000km. Cheers gc '97 HDJ80 - Melbourne Oz http://reality.sgi.com/80_series/bios/george_couyant.html From: "Mick Barson" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] 1HD-T Big End Bearings Date sent: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 09:41:09 +0800 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com George i appreciate that your a very knowledgeable person when it comes to Toyotas, but your comment to Anthony Siracusa about being OK if it is a 1HD-FT could be misleading, because mine has had its bearings and crank replaced and its a 97',pehaps hopefully for all the other owners its a one off thing and you are indeed correct,, but where theres one...................!! From: moie@effect.net.au (Anthony Siracusa) To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] 1HD-T Big End Bearings Date sent: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 11:54:27 +1000 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Hi all Phoned Toyota Customer Relations regarding this matter. I was told that Toyota switched to the 'beefed up' big end bearings in August 1994. Therefore my vehicle is OK as it was manufactured on 11 October 1994. I am writing to Toyota to get this in writing. Will keep everyone informed. Tony Siracusa Date sent: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 16:10:43 +1000 From: George Couyant Organization: SGI To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Subject: Re: [80] 1HD-T Big End Bearings Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Mick Barson wrote: > > George i appreciate that your a very knowledgeable person when it comes to > Toyotas, but your comment to Anthony Siracusa about being OK if it is a 1HD-FT > could be misleading, because mine has had its bearings and crank replaced and > its a 97',pehaps hopefully for all the other owners its a one off thing and > you are indeed correct,, but where theres one...................!! We're talking different things. The problem you were experiencing was faulty machining of the crankshaft. It's seen on 1HZ's and 1HD-FT's. It seems that it's more apparent on the 1HD-FT, probably because of the sharper power stroke. That said, you're seeing symptoms as opposed to the big end bearing problem of the 1HD-T. The motor runs fine with no symptoms. When you do hear something it's invariably too late. Any reports of big end problems on 1HZ or 1HD-FT as far as I can tell are hearsay. I don't have any solid evidence. I must admit that diagnosing these noises is very difficult. With a stiff block like that on the 1HD-FT, a noise at one end of the motor (which is barely audible) may sound like a loud clack at the other end. The noise I'm hearing is a sharp ticking between 2,100 - 2,400 rpm when hot. Dead quiet cold. Much louder under load. I'm aware of one other with these symptoms. Yours as I understand ticks at or near idle. This is similar to Mark's noise but one of his injectors sounded quite dull. The other 5 sounded crisp. Toyota have said they'll replace the crank etc on mine but I want to hold off for a while until I've exhausted all other possibilities. I've spent many many hours over the past few weeks experimenting and I'm seeing weird things. I'm working with the dealer who out of courtesy and a misguided interest is making his mechanics and equipment available to me. It's actually kind of cool. Stand back and ask "could we now crack #4 injector please". "And now, could we crack #6 injector please whilst leaving #4 cracked". "Could we now drop #1 valve clearance to 1 thou tighter than min spec and all others at max spec please".... What I'm seeing is anything that upsets the balance of power stroke balance between cylinders affects the noise. Whatever you do, don't accept Toyota's favourite excuse of secondary combustion noise. It isn't..... Stay tuned. Cheers gc From: "Craig mort" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] 1HZ Big End Bearing noise? Date sent: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 11:23:23 +1000 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Just got word back from a friend with a 1990/91 1HZ powered GXL who was doing an outback trip and had a noise that sounded like the bigend bearings going. He had tried to check the oil but coudn't get the sump plug off at the time. It wasn't the bigend bearings that caused the noise but was the sump plug magnet that came loose and started to float around and get crushed up into millions of bit's. The particles of the magnet did attract to eachother and come out of the oil solution. The bearings were all in good shape and the name has mow gone. Just something to consider. Cheers Craig cmort@bigpond.com 95 1FZ mall cruiser Date sent: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 12:31:14 +1000 From: George Couyant Organization: SGI To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Subject: Re: [80] Re: 1HD-T Big End Bearings Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com char wrote: > > Hi George I know the reply is late but i have been off line. I finally had > Toyota check my big ends guess what !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yup 1 and 3 were described > to me as spinning and had scored the camshaft. My 92 Model had 220,000 on the > clock the bill went from $300.00 to $1,500.00 Toyota would only come to the > party by 50%... Charlene, did you accept the offer to pay half? If not, you can argue that the additional cost was a consequence of the recognized failure of the big end bearings and that you are not liable. I just got off the phone to Toyota about the 1HD-T issue and am trying to kick start a customer satisfaction program. If you feel that you have been unjustly dealt with, I urge you to phone Jenny Stewart (1800 252 097) with your concern. Jenny is the CSD supervisor and is well aware of the 1HD-T issue and of our group. Toyota are in a bit of shock at the moment with the release of the Patrol TD and will be doing their best to keep customer loyalty, especially the type of customer who is willing to pay for their high margin products such as TD 80s. Cheers gc '97 HDJ80 - Melbourne Oz From: "Gary Martin" To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Date sent: Tue, 22 Jun 1999 15:23:22 +1000 Subject: [80]1HZ big end failures Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com For your info - no panic intended, and all disclaimers apply (so no one gets sued...) I was speaking to a turbo fitter earlier today (discussing turbo vs. supercharging...), and conversation got onto boost on 1HZ with aftermarket turbos...he said he hasnt had any trouble with ones he's fitted (as he keeps boost to a absolute maximum of 7psi). BUT, he knows of a few (three to four) examples of 1HZs that have had their big end bearings fail. Only one of the ones he knows is turboed, and it had the bearings spin. The others were cracked or pitted - not sure (all happened between 130 & 160 thousand kms). Toyota paid for half of the cost of the bearing/engine fix in each example (even the turbo one - which was a 75 series tray), to sooth the customers. Seeya gary ------------------------- Gary Martin Victoria AUSTRALIA email: gmartin@csu.edu.au ------------------------- From: "Mick Barson" To: "80 series on line" <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: [80] 1HD-FT crank & bearings- 3rd time lucky [Chat] Aussie Date sent: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 11:13:24 +0800 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Hi group, To those that are interested, my Cruiser is back in the = driveway after having the crank and bearings replaced by Toyota, ticking = noise has dissapeared. Mechanic informed me that there was some wear on = the bearings but not any more than expected, The "fault" seemed to be an = incorrectly machined crankshaft, they compared the old to the new with a = micrometer and there were differences, also the newer crank was = "significantly" (their words) heavier. cheers Mick : West Aussie 97' 1HD-FT (no longer ticking) ickbar@southwest.com.au Date sent: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 13:58:03 +1000 To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com From: Christopher Nicholls Subject: Re: [80] 1HD-FT crank & bearings- 3rd time lucky [Chat] Aussie Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com At 11:13 AM 25/06/99 +0800, Mick Barson wrote: >Hi group, > To those that are interested, my Cruiser is back in the >driveway after having the crank and bearings replaced by Toyota, ticking >noise has dissapeared. Mechanic informed me that there was some wear on the >bearings but not any more than expected, The "fault" seemed to be an >incorrectly machined crankshaft, they compared the old to the new with a >micrometer and there were differences, also the newer crank was "significantly" >(their words) heavier. cheers Mick : West Aussie 97' 1HD-FT (no longer ticking) >ickbar@southwest.com.au GC.... this is a worry... "they compared the old to the new with a micrometer and there were differences, also the newer crank was "significantly" (their words) heavier." Why/when did they change the crank-shaft? Regards Chris '97 HDJ80 - Canberra, Oz From: "Mick Barson" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] 1HD-FT crank & bearings- 3rd time lucky [Chat] Aussie Date sent: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 12:56:30 +0800 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com >GC.... this is a worry... > >"they compared the old to the new with a micrometer and there were >differences, also the newer crank was "significantly" (their words) heavier." > >Why/when did they change the crank-shaft? > >Regards > >Chris >'97 HDJ80 - Canberra, Oz Chris i have mailed you previously with my details on the crank "problem" to your home address, did you not receive it? Just Quickly to bring you up to date: my 97' compliance ,Dec 96' build had a ticking sound at approx 40 thou klms, crank & bearings replaced under warranty, ticking noise reappeared again and crank & bearings replaced again at 65 thou klms. A check by the State Service manager revealed that the crank (no 2) had not been replaced by the revised model. He stated that this had nothing to do with the bearing problems of the earlier models! Which brings me to suggest that some 24v turbos will tick and others wont depending on which model crank went in. cheers Mick : West Aussie 97' 1HD-FT ickbar@southwest.com.au Date sent: Fri, 25 Jun 1999 14:37:21 +1000 From: George Couyant Organization: SGI To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Subject: Re: [80] 1HD-FT crank & bearings- 3rd time lucky [Chat] Aussie Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Christopher Nicholls wrote: > Why/when did they change the crank-shaft? Officially, the new crankshaft is because of a completely new machine installed in japan which machines them. It's the same crankshaft that goes into 1HZ's, 1HD-T's and 1HD-FT's and simply has tighter journal taper tolerances. That said, the people I've been speaking to about it have been very cagey and buggered if I can get two people to say the same thing. I suspect that Toyota thinks it has a customer satisfaction issue on its hands and that they are dealing with it in the way they have in the past. If I piece the bullshit together and disregard the obviously false (or uninformed) stuff, I end up with "the new crankshaft is stiffer with tighter machining tolerances and it eliminates any 'ting ting ting' noises that can't be eliminated by any other means". Toyota will consider replacing those which they consider to be "excessively" noisy (basically means you have to fight them and convince them that it's excessively noisy). Not that there should be any problem in the future, but just in case, it's worth while reporting any noises to the dealer and to have an idea of whether it's getting worse. I listened to another yesterday built Mar '97 and other than a very faint tick at 1,200rpm, it was dead quiet. And that tick, you *really* had to listen for. It had done 90,000km and probably won't get any worse. Cheers gc '97 HDJ80 - Melbourne Oz http://reality.sgi.com/80_series/bios/george_couyant.html From: "Gary Tierney" To: "80 Series Group" <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: [80] 1HD-T Big End problems (more) Date sent: Sat, 17 Jul 1999 10:00:03 +1000 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com More info for any that need it. Purchase 91 GXL 1HD-T in 97 with 145K on the clock. At about 150K a = slight "tick" was notice at about 2000 RPM. Many workshops consulted, no = ideas. At 169K Big End rattle, wife was driving and stopped immediately = (she=92s a good girl isn=92t she). Happened 35km from home so towed to = nearest workshop (not Toyota). They found No 6 big end bearing failure = and the rest badly pitted (particularly No 5). Crankshaft OK so clean up = and fit new bearings. All seemed OK but "tick" still there. At 178K big end rattle, this time near home, so I took it to the local = Toyota dealer and sure enough No 6 big end failure. Also identified = crankshaft crack (axial crack in no 6 big end journal starting at oil = gallery and extending forward about 10 mm). The dealer approached Toyota = on my behalf and they agreed to come half way with the bill (except for = normal wear items). Thank you Toyota, I was worried as I do my own = maintenance every 5000k. Rebuilt by local Toyota dealer including new = crankshaft, pistons, rings, etc. Total cost to me $4500 Aust.=20 Now have 186K on the clock running fine and yes the "tick" is still = there but it is quieter. Any recommendations for Oil I should be using. = Was using Castrol but now not so sure. Now, I have a friend with same model car and about the same mileage. He = is tossing up whether to get his bearings checked. I think he should as = the cost of a set of bearings and fitting is minimal compared to the = cost of a rebuild. Gary 91 GXL 1HD-T From: "Craig Mort" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] 1hd-t bearing troubles - new theory / rumour Date sent: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 20:58:37 +1000 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com I've hear a report from a friend (treat it as a rumour for now) that it isn't the bearings that are causing the troubles but is the crankshaft. The claim stems from a fitter and turner who owns one and had several sets of new bearings fitted. After several sets of bearings he pulled out the crankshaft and found that it wasn't straight. Whether it was machined like that at Toyota or out of balance and bent over time. I don't know how much out it was but may have been just outside of the tolerances. This may be good to check out. GC, This isn't the reason that they replaced your crank is it? Cheers Craig cmort@bigpond.com Date sent: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 13:50:46 +1000 From: George Couyant Organization: SGI To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Subject: Re: [80] Penrite Oil Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Alistair I. Paul wrote: > Could this be why all your 1HD-T bearings are failing???? ;-) Well actually, those running on Mobil 1 don't seem to suffer the problem. Incidentally, I haven't come across one '90 - '94 1HD-T motor with the updated big end bearings which have shown signs of failure. I'm beginning to think that they've finally fixed them. Cheers gc '97 HDJ80 - Melbourne Oz From: "Ron Smith" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] Penrite Oil Date sent: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 20:41:14 +1000 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com I have been running Penrite HPR Pedigree since new with no problems and good oil pressure in my 4.5lt petrol (116,000km). A relation of mine has a 92 TD and is in the marine business. He use a straight 50w oil all the time and when his bearings were checked at 94,000km, there was no sign of wear. From: "Willem-Jan Markerink" To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Date sent: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 13:19:35 +0100 Subject: [80] Big end bearings (was Re: CV joint Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com On 15 Nov 99 at 9:03, Ian B wrote: > Dan, > > CBC Bearings keep the outer axle assy in stock for a much cheaper > price. The item comes from the same manufacturer that Toyota use, > I've been told . Speaking of bearings, what was that brand of aftermarket big-end bearings? OEM Toyota uses aluminium shell + tin lining, but one aftermarket company supplied copper/brass shell + lead lining, correct? Which company is this? Also CBC? And have there been reports on respective wear in the mean time? IOW: are they indeed better? (I recall that copper/lead is the rule in the industry, while alu/tin is considered a cheap shot) -- Bye, Willem-Jan Markerink The desire to understand is sometimes far less intelligent than the inability to understand [note: 'a-one' & 'en-el'!] From: AU Sunshine-mgr Western Farm Service To: "'80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com'" <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: RE: [80] Big end bearings (was Re: CV joint Date sent: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 16:34:35 -0600 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com > > CBC Bearings keep the outer axle assy in stock for a much cheaper > > price. The item comes from the same manufacturer that Toyota use, > > I've been told . > > Speaking of bearings, what was that brand of aftermarket big-end > bearings? > OEM Toyota uses aluminium shell + tin lining, but one aftermarket company > supplied copper/brass shell + lead lining, correct? Which company is this? > Also CBC? And have there been reports on respective wear in the mean time? > IOW: are they indeed better? (I recall that copper/lead is the rule in the > industry, while alu/tin is considered a cheap shot) WJM, I believe I read somewhere that the company which sold the aftermarket copper backed big end bearing's for the 80's was ACL in Aust. ACL stands for Automotive Components Limited. Their URL is http://www.acl.com.au/web/corp.nsf I am not sure how they performed, or how the supposed "changed metalurgy" in the replacement Toyota bearings has gone as mine has only done about 60,000kms on the replacement bearings. CBC (Consolidated Bearing Company) here in Aust. sell mainly ball bearings and associated hardware. I know that Hardy Spicer here in Aust. also carry the replacement CV joints for the 80's. Regards, Greg Goulden 1990 HDJ80 TD-I Date sent: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 20:07:23 +1100 To: "Willem-Jan Markerink" From: Terence J Leeder Subject: [80] aftermarket Big end bearings >On 15 Nov 99 at 9:03, Ian B wrote: > >> Dan, >> >> CBC Bearings keep the outer axle assy in stock for a much cheaper >> price. The item comes from the same manufacturer that Toyota use, >> I've been told . > "Willem-Jan Markerink" Wrote: >Speaking of bearings, what was that brand of aftermarket big-end >bearings? >OEM Toyota uses aluminium shell + tin lining, but one aftermarket company >supplied copper/brass shell + lead lining, correct? Which company is this? Also >CBC? And have there been reports on respective wear in the mean time? IOW: are >they indeed better? (I recall that copper/lead is the rule in the industry, >while alu/tin is considered a cheap shot) > G'Day Willem, I will reply offline because I don't want my ass kicked again by some people. The copper/brass as you have stated above is good for loads and long service. The company we use in here in OZ, is ACL brand bearings. The ACL heavy duty bearings have an oil well groove around the middle of the bearing to hold a oil reserve. It's interesting to note that Toyota have changed bearing design on the 1HD-FTE The shell has many radial grooves in the circumferential direction over the surface of the bearings. To Quote Toyota "This improves the bearing break-in and oil retention, thus improving the reliability of the engine" They do not mention they have used a different material in the bearings as used previously! Goodluck Terry From: "Kevin Hughes" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: RE: [80] Big end bearings (was Re: CV joint Date sent: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 06:36:24 +1100 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com -----Original Message----- From: owner-80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com [mailto:owner-80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com]On Behalf Of AU Sunshine-mgr Western Farm Service Sent: Tuesday, 16 November 1999 9:35 To: '80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com' Subject: RE: [80] Big end bearings (was Re: CV joint ****************************************************************** Just on the subject of Big End Bearings..... I have just had my 91 TD, (130K) replaced. Had a struggle with Toyota and the local dealer. Got the right results in the end. Toyota paid half and with a little more pushing paid half of my half.... all up cost to me about $120aus for the full replacement job. Dropped the truck off 8am Monday morning 15/11 and picked it up this arvo 16/11.... I think the Dealer was a little surprised to find damage to the bearings. No.3 was badly pitted.. I have made arrangements to photograph the bearings and will get them to the group as soon as I can. The rest of the bearings looked pretty good.. Good thing out of the way and a little piece of mind, considering I only purchased it 7 weeks ago... Photo's to come Regards Kiwi Date sent: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 07:58:27 +1100 From: Gary Roberts To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Subject: Re: [80] 1991 80 Series Turbo Diesel Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Lobo Fraser wrote: > Hi all, > > I now the pages of 80 Series online has problems listed about big ends etc. > However apart from this problem the Vehicles seem a good one. I am considering > buying one which has done 280000Kms. I am not sure if the big ends have been > done. It a cost I will have to allow for. What I am after is a little bit of > advice on what to look with these vehicle and if 280000kms is to much. I will > be travelling in remote parts of QLD and NT in January and don't want to get > stuck. > > Thanks > Lobo Fraser > onelittlefish@bigpond.com Lobo, If the bearings have been done by Toyota there would have been a silver sticker placed near the inside hinge on the driver side door. This is a common practice with any recall/warranty work. If the numbers are still visible check their meaning with Toyota. Cheers, Gary From: Couyant_George@emc.com To: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Subject: [80] More big ends.... Date sent: Mon, 3 Jan 2000 21:58:48 -0500 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Another reminder for those of you who have not had their big end bearings checked on their 1HD-T ('90 - '95 turbo diesel) motors. Over the Christmas break, I was contacted by 7 people who's holiday was stuffed by big end related major engine failures. And that's only from those who know of the 80sCOOL site. Cheers gc '97 HDJ80 - Melbourne Oz From: "Norm Needham" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] More big ends.... Date sent: Tue, 4 Jan 2000 23:06:46 +1100 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com From: > Another reminder for those of you who have not had their big end bearings > checked on their 1HD-T ('90 - '95 turbo diesel) motors. > > Over the Christmas break, I was contacted by 7 people who's holiday was > stuffed by big end related major engine failures. And that's only from those > who know of the 80sCOOL site. > We cannot stress enough the need to be diligent in this area. We had one arrive on a tow truck today from Tamworth. Another ruined holiday; but not only that. The owner had gone to a Toyota dealer very recently and asked them to check it for him. The check involved the service adviser lifting the bonnet, listening for a few seconds, and pronouncing the engine healthy. The ONLY way to check the bearings properly is to remove them. Cheers * Norm Needham * * Traction4 / ARB Northside * Sydney, Australia * Trac4@bigpond.com From: "Norm Needham" To: "80sCOOL" <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: Re: [80] More big ends.... Date sent: Wed, 5 Jan 2000 21:44:41 +1100 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com From: Brian Combley > Norm > > I have one of the offending engines. What is the story with Toyota, mine > is a 92 manufacture 93 compliance plate. Do they offer any assistance / > parts or whatever or is it better to do the job yourself. I have a > reasonable workshop and tools but few special Toyota tools. > We assume "offending" means an engine in the suspect range; not one that has expired. Talk to your local dealer, and perhaps get the regional Toyota rep involved. Use a sane and amicable approach, and they should come to the party. It is obviously much cheaper, and good insurance, for Toyota to remove/check/replace your bearings now than to wear half the cost of a total rebuild later. When this problem first surfaced, Toyota, to their credit, was reimbursing those who had bearings replaced outside their dealer network. If "offending" means it has indeed expired, then Toyota should, again, come to the party. Recent cases of high kilometre vehicles have seen them pay half. GC may have more information on Toyota's current preparedness to commit? Cheers * Norm Needham * * Traction4 / ARB Northside * Sydney, Australia * Trac4@bigpond.com From: "andrew westcott" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: [80] re-more big ends Date sent: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 09:13:54 +1100 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Brian=20 i just had my big ends replaced and i was charged half the = costs($250).I only had 111 thousand k's up which i don't regard as high = mileage, but was told that Toyota were now winding back their payout's = on this repair as the problem is now becoming an old one.They told me = that they would be paying less as time rolled on.P.s. check with Toyota = to make sure your bearings have'nt already been replaced. Andrew From: "Kevin Hughes" To: <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: RE: [80] More big ends.... Date sent: Thu, 6 Jan 2000 22:07:38 +1100 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Brian, Have not long had my 91 done in Coonabarabran, took some of the piccy's into the local Toy dealer and he was a little shocked and dis-believing. Any stuck to my guns and finally got Toy to go halves with the total cost..... a little more pressure and got the lovely lady at customer service to pay half of my half as well. finished up at $125Aus.. No.3 was stuffed and the rest were of reasonable condition. had 128kms on it at the time... Best of luck and stick with it, they will give in. Just as a side note at the same time a 92 came in with 400lms on it and had blown the motor. Had the bearings done at 380kms at full price to the owner..... Toy have paid for a full replacement mtr for this one.... one the group could keep in mind.. Keep Shining <> Kiwi From: "Kevin Hughes" To: "80 Series" <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: [80] FW: failure notice Date sent: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 15:17:27 +1100 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com Brian, Ive had the vehicle for about 3-4 months now, I found out about the big end problem on 80 Series page. (thanks to the guys and gals). It has a good service record and the dealer was keen to see the books. It has been serviced regularly and I contacted the original owner who lives in SA. did the oil every 5000kms with out fail. Even did the changes in the Simpson Desert while he was travelling.. I beleive that the problem is with the bearing themselves, I think Toy Aust has admitted that by the offers they have put forward to TD owners over the past few years. You must stay at them and they will come to the party. The best I think is half these days, better than nothing. My dealer went to bat for me and got half of my half as well, I had just brought the vehicle and they did not want to pay the lot if it died...... Best of luck Keep shining <> Kev From: "Mazza, Stephen (HI)" To: "'80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com'" <80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com> Subject: RE: [80] More big ends.... Date sent: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 13:14:44 +0800 Send reply to: 80_series@sgiblab.sgi.com > > Another reminder for those of you who have not had their big end > bearings > > checked on their 1HD-T ('90 - '95 turbo diesel) motors. > > > > Over the Christmas break, I was contacted by 7 people who's holiday > was > > stuffed by big end related major engine failures. And that's only from > those > > who know of the 80sCOOL site. > > > Just back from holidays and caught this thread. And thought I would put my two bobs worth in. (Sorry 5c worth) Have a friend who has a '94 TD LC with 190K km. Big ends were done (At his cost, the idiot) by a less than reputable dealer in the south. @178K km (We were assuming they were never done before) @190K km bad Knocking and damage to head etc. etc. etc. Well he fixed the problem for good. Drove in to a local engine exchange shop. Drove out two days later with a 6.5 litre V8 diesel. He is now happy as a pig in s**t. By the way they gave him $2000 for the stuffed motor (1200 for turbo) Stephen Mazza Paraburdoo, Western Australia White '97 GXL Diesel, TJM Bar, Dual Batteries, Airtech Snorkel, PolyAirs