To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com From: "beanz2dt" Date: Sat, 25 Sep 2004 16:54:19 -0000 Subject: [80_aus] New to the group - Isuzu clutch to Toyota 5 speed Reply-To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com Hi folks, I am relatively new to the group, since I joined I haven't been reading the posts very much as I am on e-mail hold status. I finally gathered up enough courage to post here :) My posts and replies to the diesel list (DTLC) don't seem to reach it for some reason. I am currently undertaking a new project rarely done on these shores (US) and I need help from the experts Down Under and elsewhere. I have an HJ75 troopie I am swapping a 1994 1HD-T engine from a GXL package HDJ80. To keep the project simple, my friend who is doing the actual work (while I watch :) ) is going to install it with an H55f transmission from a '93 HZJ73 and the troopie's transfer. Later if I'm keen I can swap an H150f and part-time transfer from a DX package 80 series when all the minute details of the engine swap such as wiring, power steering, AC, instrumentation, etc. have been addressed. I decided to save the H151f and full time transfer from the GXL for another project. On the good recommendation of DTLC members who are also on this group, we are planning to use an Isuzu NPR truck clutch disc as it seems to have the correct diameter, input shaft size and spline count to match the H55f and later the H150f. My question to the group: Does the Isuzu disc on a Toyota 5 speed fit well on the input shaft or should I expect any looseness? I am trying to get others opinions prior to ordering the disc as they are quite expensive. Thanks for any input. Cheers, Dave To: <80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com> From: "TJL_NSW_OZ" Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2004 10:36:38 +1000 Subject: RE: [80_aus] New to the group - Isuzu clutch to Toyota 5 speed Reply-To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com G'Day Dave, Not having done exactly what you are involved in. but suffice it to say that when you place the clutch disc/plate onto the splines of the transmission the disc must slide freely to and fro. The disc should not be loose, wobble sideways or when moved up and down 90 deg to its axis to the extent that it has excessive movement. It is quite common to have many different vehicle models use the same clutch plate and have matching splines. The pressure plate being the dominating factor in clutch clamping pressure. Having said that does the fellow doing the work feel confident that he will be able to pick up any abnormality in the spline area of the clutch disc? Regards TJL Syd OZ 97 TD with a few gadgets To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com From: "beanz2dt" Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2004 02:10:40 -0000 Subject: Re: [80_aus] New to the group - Isuzu clutch to Toyota 5 speed Reply-To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com --- In 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com, "TJL_NSW_OZ" wrote: > G'Day Dave, > > Not having done exactly what you are involved in. but suffice it to say > that when you place the clutch disc/plate onto the splines of the > transmission the disc must slide freely to and fro. The disc should not > be loose, wobble sideways or when moved up and down 90 deg to its axis > to the extent that it has excessive movement. It is quite common to have > many different vehicle models use the same clutch plate and have > matching splines. The pressure plate being the dominating factor in > clutch clamping pressure. > > Having said that does the fellow doing the work feel confident that he > will be able to pick up any abnormality in the spline area of the clutch > disc? > > > Regards > TJL > Syd > OZ > 97 TD with a few gadgets Hi TJL, I'm trying to avoid buying an expensive disc just to find it fitting poorly on the input shaft. Because it is not stocked at the dealer, it has to be ordered fully prepaid without chance of refund. The fellow doing the install has done two 1HD-T swaps before, one on his own 60 series and another on an FJ45 wagon. His approach had been to machine out the 14-spline center on a factory 1HD-T clutch, inserting a machined down 21-spline center from a 1HZ disc and TIG welding the pieces together. He's never used the Isuzu clutch before. He was originally the one who raised the issue I am now asking this group. Cheers and thanks for the reply, Dave To: <80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com> From: "TJL_NSW_OZ" Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 11:00:10 +1000 Subject: RE: [80_aus] New to the group - Isuzu clutch to Toyota 5 speed Reply-To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com G'Day Dave, What he wants to do [cut and weld plate hub] is not the norm! It can work but you may have balance issues, weld strength issues etc. Diesels have a lot of torque to perhaps beak welds. I don't like it but that doesn't mean it won't work. I can see your problems re non refund if incorrect. Can't your supplier tell you the spline numbers and dia of the clutch disc as our blokes here in OZ can? This will then be definitive if it will fit or not. We generally use Non Genuine in cases like this and order a Daikin Clutch or similar. Our non genuine suppliers have al the specs on all clutch disc's and can tell us what spline etc. Regards TJL Syd OZ 97 TD with a few gadgets To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com From: andrew lukies Date: Sun, 26 Sep 2004 20:13:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: RE: [80_aus] New to the group - Isuzu clutch to Toyota 5 speed Reply-To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com --- TJL_NSW_OZ wrote: > G'Day Dave, > > What he wants to do [cut and weld plate hub] is not > the norm! It can > work but you may have balance issues, weld strength > issues etc. Diesels > have a lot of torque to perhaps beak welds. I don't > like it but that > doesn't mean it won't work. I can see your problems > re non refund if > incorrect. Can't your supplier tell you the spline > numbers and dia of > the clutch disc as our blokes here in OZ can? This > will then be > definitive if it will fit or not. > We generally use Non Genuine in cases like this and > order a Daikin > Clutch or similar. Our non genuine suppliers have al > the specs on all > clutch disc's and can tell us what spline etc. > > > Regards > TJL > Syd > OZ > 97 TD with a few gadgets Gday Dave i know a guy who used a heavy duty 1hz clutch with a hdt in a 75...no issues other than a heavier pedal. I would say the spline arrangement would be a subject to some sort of standard, so they should be compatable. On the other side of things, you may need to change the throw out bearing if using a hdt pressure plate/clutch, as it might be shorter to accomidate a thicker clutch...i have one here on a h151 i can measure if u like... From previous experiance, i know the bellhousings from hz to hd are thesame, and the flywheels are interchangeable, but must use applicable clutch. Andrew in 0z, (with summer approaching fast:-)) To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com From: "beanz2dt" Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 04:47:58 -0000 Subject: Re: [80_aus] New to the group - Isuzu clutch to Toyota 5 speed Reply-To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com --- In 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com, "TJL_NSW_OZ" wrote: > G'Day Dave, > > What he wants to do [cut and weld plate hub] is not the norm! It can > work but you may have balance issues, weld strength issues etc. Diesels > have a lot of torque to perhaps beak welds. I don't like it but that > doesn't mean it won't work. I can see your problems re non refund if > incorrect. Can't your supplier tell you the spline numbers and dia of > the clutch disc as our blokes here in OZ can? This will then be > definitive if it will fit or not. > We generally use Non Genuine in cases like this and order a Daikin > Clutch or similar. Our non genuine suppliers have al the specs on all > clutch disc's and can tell us what spline etc. > > > Regards > TJL > Syd > OZ > 97 TD with a few gadgets Hi TJL, The Daikin website fortunately describes the input shaft measurements which seem to be right on. I do have the feeling it would fit, just seeking confirmation here. I'll try ordering it and see it for myself. I'll try to post the findings here. Cheers, Dave To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com From: "beanz2dt" Date: Mon, 27 Sep 2004 04:55:50 -0000 Subject: Re: [80_aus] New to the group - Isuzu clutch to Toyota 5 speed Reply-To: 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com --- In 80scool_aus@yahoogroups.com, andrew lukies wrote: > Gday Dave > i know a guy who used a heavy duty 1hz clutch with a > hdt in a 75...no issues other than a heavier pedal. > I would say the spline arrangement would be a subject > to some sort of standard, so they should be > compatable. > On the other side of things, you may need to change > the throw out bearing if using a hdt pressure > plate/clutch, as it might be shorter to accomidate a > thicker clutch...i have one here on a h151 i can > measure if u like... > From previous experiance, i know the bellhousings from > hz to hd are thesame, and the flywheels are > interchangeable, but must use applicable clutch. > Andrew in 0z, (with summer approaching fast:-)) Hi Andrew, I'll try using the HDT throw out bearing first since I have a new unit sitting here. You brought out a good point though, the T/O bearing may have different lengths and that might change the relationship of the fork to the clutch since we are using the 1HZ to H55f bellhousing and fork. Cheers, Dave -autumn is in the air here, nice relief from the heat! To: 80scool@yahoogroups.com From: "beanz2dt" Date: Tue, 02 Nov 2004 20:21:01 -0000 Subject: [80] Isuzu clutch for 1HD-T Reply-To: 80scool@yahoogroups.com Hey gang, This message is a follow up to the thread previously on 80scool_aus. Just to summarise for the rest of the 80scool members who weren't on the aus list, I'm in the middle of installing a 1HD-T into an HJ75. The H55f gearbox location is retained to keep the propeller shafts, crossmember and shifter location. A gearbox from an HZJ73 is used in the place of the H151 at least for now. To allow us to run a 300mm clutch disc and keep the input shaft unchanged, an Isuzu clutch was purchased. Expensive buggers those discs are, they cost twice what genuine Toyota 1HD-T discs cost. There was question whether the Isuzu disc would fit the Toyota input shaft. Well, the disc fits perfectly, the shape of the splines, depth, diameter, etc. seem to be made for the Toyota, LOL. It also has six springs as compared to four on the genuine disc. This would also work well if one were to swap an H150 gearbox from a Standard package HZJ80 into a turbo diesel or vice versa. Cheers, Dave To: <80scool@yahoogroups.com> From: "Ernie Millen" Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2004 21:03:50 +1100 Subject: Re: [80] Isuzu clutch for 1HD-T Reply-To: 80scool@yahoogroups.com > Well, the disc fits perfectly, the shape of the splines, depth, > diameter, etc. seem to be made for the Toyota, LOL. It also has six > springs as compared to four on the genuine disc. Hmmm, interesting... Got a part number Dave ? :)) Cheers, Ernie Millen 11/91 HDJ80GXL 1HD-T http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ernie60 To: 80scool@yahoogroups.com From: "beanz2dt" Date: Wed, 03 Nov 2004 15:49:44 -0000 Subject: Re: [80] Isuzu clutch for 1HD-T Reply-To: 80scool@yahoogroups.com --- In 80scool@yahoogroups.com, "Ernie Millen" wrote: > Hmmm, interesting... Got a part number Dave ? :)) > > Cheers, > Ernie Millen 11/91 HDJ80GXL 1HD-T > http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ernie60 Isuzu part No. 8-94462-789-3, Daikin No. ISD134. Cheers, Dave To: <80scool@yahoogroups.com> From: "Ernie Millen" Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 20:48:25 +1100 Subject: Re: [80] Isuzu clutch for 1HD-T Reply-To: 80scool@yahoogroups.com > Isuzu part No. 8-94462-789-3, Daikin No. ISD134. > > Cheers, > Dave Good one ! thanks Dave :) BTW, what inspired you to this discovery and how did you wind up finding the Isuzu plate would fit ? Cheers, Ernie Millen 11/91 HDJ80GXL 1HD-T http://members.optusnet.com.au/~ernie60 To: 80scool@yahoogroups.com From: "Greg Goulden" Date: Fri, 05 Nov 2004 00:37:05 -0000 Subject: Re: [80] Isuzu clutch for 1HD-T Reply-To: 80scool@yahoogroups.com --- In 80scool@yahoogroups.com, "Ernie Millen" wrote: > > Good one ! thanks Dave :) > BTW, what inspired you to this discovery and how did you wind up finding the Isuzu plate would fit ? > > Cheers, > Ernie Millen 11/91 HDJ80GXL 1HD-T Where you been Ernie? This topic was discussed in detail on the 80sCool_aus list a few weeks back. Have a search of the archives there. Regards, Greg Goulden 2000 HDJ105